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Did the aztecs predict the coming of the Spanish?
Apr 13, 2009 2:00 PM
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Was Cortez really QUETZALCOATL ? The prediction does sound a bit similar to Christ's return and execution?
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Posts:
4
From:
las vegas
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5/17/09
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Re: Did the aztecs predict the coming of the Spanish?
May 17, 2009 2:16 AM
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In several monuments from before the post-classic period of the different mexican cultures QUETZACOATL" is represented by a feathered snake. The city of Tehotihuacan has a temple dedicated to Quetzacoatl. This city had been abandoned by the Toltecs by 900 A.D. it is located on the highlands of Central Mexico, Colombus discovered America on 1492, Cortes arrived in Tenochtitlan on the early 1500's and was welcomed by Emperator Cuauhtemoc thinking was the prophecy of Quetzacoatl. The best accepted theory is as follows: A white blond barbed man came to the coast of Mexico after he survived a shipwreck, he was saved and protected by the local people, He very likely thought. If I got here by accident, eventualy some other european will get here with his ship intact. (was he a viking? maybe) but he made the prediction White Barbed men will come from the East , Everything will change, nothing will be the same. a new race will develop and so on. Well he knew American lands would be claimed and occupied by foreigners, soldiers, adventurers, with no wives, so, they would form a new kind of people mixture of indigenous and european. that is how the mexican people of today happened to be.
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10/15/09
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Re: Did the aztecs predict the coming of the Spanish?
Oct 15, 2009 5:32 PM
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Doña Marina was part of the reason why the Spanish were able to take over, and her assistance to Cortes would eventually lead to her being called a traitor. Perhaps the indigenous Mexicans believed Cortez was Quetzalcoatl, but she was instrumental in making people believe that. People on this earth believe it will one day die, or we'll have Jetsons-like society. Some things are bound to happen as people start to believe in them. It doesn't mean it is true, it just appears so until someone can disprove it. People believe in Christ, but there is little to prove it to those who do not believe.
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Posts:
1
From:
tecate BC
Registered:
10/20/09
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Re: Did the aztecs predict the coming of the Spanish?
Oct 20, 2009 5:58 PM
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ofcurse not they had a god which is one of the three most famous gods of the mexican cultures named Quetzalcoatl the name is in nahuatl which Quetzal means eagle and coatl means snake and if you fuse it means feddered snake. Quetzalcoatl in the leyend he goes by ocean saying that he would return up a great beast and with a mustacho but he never returned. when Cortez arrives to mexico the aztecs found him up a beast which was a horse but since ice age there was no horses in all America the most familiar was the llama but they where located in south America so there were no horses and they though cortez was Quetzalcoatl thats the reason they didnt attacked the spanish but they really didnt know that Cortez wasnt Quetzalcoatl if they didnt brought horses they may had been killed.
PD. Im mexican and i dont remember how to write some words
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Posts:
15
From:
Colorado, USA.
Registered:
10/23/09
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(5 of 11)
Re: Did the aztecs predict the coming of the Spanish?
Oct 23, 2009 1:29 PM
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hibiscusflower makes a very valid observation about Doña Marina's (Malinche) role in the conquest of the Aztecs. Also, according to Bernal Diaz del Castillo in his memoirs 'The Discovery and Conquest of Mexico', Cortés was very well aware of the legend of Quetzalcoatl and played into it in order to drain Mexico of it's gold. Did the Aztecs predict the coming of the Spanish? Though I don't think that they specifically predicted the coming of the Spanish, the Aztecs most certainly opened up a critical avenue in their demise with the well timed arrival of Cortés. (His landing on the shores of Mexico EXACTLY coincided (coincidence?) TO THE DAY with the prophecy of Quetzalcoatl's return.)
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5,263
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San Francisco, CA
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Re: Did the aztecs predict the coming of the Spanish?
Oct 25, 2009 9:34 PM
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Well Joe is they perdicated the Spanish were coming it would not be the same as the Feathered Serpent was coming would it?
Are you like the Hibiscus barker?
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Posts:
15
From:
Colorado, USA.
Registered:
10/23/09
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(7 of 11)
Re: Did the aztecs predict the coming of the Spanish?
Oct 26, 2009 9:53 AM
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SFV, could you elaborate on your reply? The cryptic brevity of your post is preventing me from understanding your intention, and I would enjoy continuing this discussion in an informed manner.
The Aztecs most certainly predicted the return of the great white bearded god Quetzalcoatl on 1-Reed. The fact that Cortés landed in Mexico on 1-Reed doesn't necessarily mean he did so unknowingly or accidentally. There were three Spanish expeditions along the Mexican coast prior to Cortés in 1519. The first was by Solis and Piñzon in 1508 followed by Grijalva and Cordoba in 1517 and 1518. Spanish historical documents prior to Cortés's landing in Mexico indicate that the Spanish settlers in Cuba, Española, Puerto Rico, etc., were aware of the Quetzalcoatl legend (slave traders picked up Mayan and Aztecs along the coast who provided the info). In all probability Cortés had foreknowledge of the event and landed in Mexico on the predicted date of Quetzalcoatl's return in order to further his ambitions.
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Posts:
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San Francisco, CA
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Re: Did the aztecs predict the coming of the Spanish?
Oct 26, 2009 11:37 PM
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There is no brevity to it Joe, I am just pointing that you seem to be Hibiscus' barker, plain and simple.
On the historical note, Cortez does not mention any foreknowledge of the prophecies, nor does Bernal Diaz de Castillo, one would have to think you speculation better put else where, as to had said knowledge would be more than a worthy historical note for either chronicler to have mentioned. Both writers claim it to have been coincidental, and both writters make claim that the Spanish did make good use of the confusion. Why would they not mention this?
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Posts:
15
From:
Colorado, USA.
Registered:
10/23/09
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(9 of 11)
Re: Did the aztecs predict the coming of the Spanish?
Oct 29, 2009 10:19 AM
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"These Caciques [Aztec officials] also told us that they had learnt from their forefathers that one of their Idols, to which they paid the greatest devotion [Quetzalcoatl], had told them that men would come from distant lands in the direction of the rising sun to subjugate them and govern them, and that if we were those men, they were rejoiced at it...
"Then our Captain Cortés replied to them and said that certainly we came from the direction of the sunrise and that our Lord the King [Charles V of Spain] had sent us for this purpose...for he had heard of them..."
Bernal Diaz del Castillo, The Discovery and Conquest of Mexico, p. 158. Farrar, Straus and Cudahy, New York, 1956.
Again, Cortés was fully aware of the legend of Quetzalcoatl and Bernal Diaz del Castillo makes this fact perfectly clear in his memoirs.
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Posts:
5,263
From:
San Francisco, CA
Registered:
11/7/06
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(10 of 11)
Re: Did the aztecs predict the coming of the Spanish?
Nov 1, 2009 12:43 PM
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>>>>"Española, Puerto Rico, etc., were aware of the Quetzalcoatl legend (slave traders picked up Mayan and Aztecs along the coast who provided the info). In all probability Cortés had foreknowledge of the event and landed in Mexico on the predicted date of Quetzalcoatl's return in order to further his ambitions. "<<<<<
>>>""These Caciques [Aztec officials] also told us that they had learnt from their forefathers that one of their Idols, to which they paid the greatest devotion [Quetzalcoatl], had told them that men would come from distant lands in the direction of the rising sun to subjugate them and govern them,"<<<<
>>>>"Again, Cortés was fully aware of the legend of Quetzalcoatl and Bernal Diaz del Castillo makes this fact perfectly clear in his memoirs"<<<<
Do you think that to twist words is.... what clever?
>>>>>"On the historical note, Cortez does not mention any foreknowledge of the prophecies, nor does Bernal Diaz de Castillo, one would have to think you speculation better put else where, as to had said knowledge would be more than a worthy historical note for either chronicler to have mentioned"<<<<
Those words were in direct response to your own claim, underlined text that you, yourself, made that Cortez landed on that day on purpose. Now you prove my claim, that the Spanish discovered this coincidence and best of it, and make it your own? Do you not value your own word?
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Posts:
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(11 of 11)
Re: Did the aztecs predict the coming of the Spanish?
Nov 1, 2009 12:53 PM
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Joe I never have liked having to cut and paste words, but you are twisting and I find it necessary as you are not being straight forward. I do expect this, straight forwardness, from those I talk to here.
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